PDC geschwindigkeitsabhängig automatisch aktivieren

[Struppel]

Mein Fahrzeug hat PDC auch vorn. Wäre es möglich, eine Option einzubauen, mit der PDC automatisch aktiviert wird, wenn eine bestimmte Geschwindigkeit unterschritten wird?  Ich bin mal Mercedes gefahren, da war das so und ich fand das sehr komfortabel.  Wenn ich vorwärts einparke, muss ich sonst immer kurz den Einparkvorgang unterbrechen, PDC manuell zuschalten und dann weiter einparken. Das würde entfallen, wenn sich PDC z.B. bei einer Gesschwindigkeit unter 15 oder 10 km/h automatisch zuschalten und bei Übeschreiten wieder abschalten würde.

[Andre]

Hi, wir hatten diese Idee auch schon.
Hieße aber in der Stadt an jeder Ampel geht das PDC an.. ich weiß nicht ob das das Ziel ist.
Ich kenne es nur von aktuellen Fahrzeugen, da geht das PDC "inaktiv" an.. heißt es ist da, wird aber erst gezeigt, wenn ein Hindernis erkannt wird.. 
Das wird dann schon schwieriger umzusetzen.. bzw artet in einem Hin-  und Herschalten aus, wenn man die Anzeige davon abhängig macht.

[Struppel]

Hallo, Danke für die schnelle Reaktion.
Mich würde es nicht stören, wenn an jeder Ampel das PDC angeht. Es piept ja nur, wenn man dann wirklich sehr nah an das nächste Fahrzeug heranfährt oder das nächste Fahrzeug sehr dicht auffährt. Bei dem Mercedes war das damals auch so. Es hat sich an jeder Ampel aktiviert. Ich bin allerdings auch nicht ständig in großen Städten unterwegs.
Vielleicht könntet Ihr das geschwindigkeitsabhängige Aktivieren des PDC als Option implementieren. Wer es möchte, kann es dann aktivieren, wen es stört, der setzt den Haken in den Einstellungen nicht.

[Andre]

Wir schauen uns das noch mal an.. mal sehen ;-)

[freddykat]

Wir schauen uns das noch mal an.. mal sehen ;-)

I'm looking for the same thing.....
However, I think we can approach this "problem" using the Ibus system of the car, instead of the speed signal.

Intro:
My specific situation is that I have an E39 PDC module retrofitted to the E46, thus having full OEM front + back PDC (front sensors are from 1' series to have them flush-mounted and almost invisible on E46) 

I´ve done some research online and think the best way to do it is to read the PDC Ibus messages and when a front obstruction is detected the PDC sents a specific Ibus message on the system (still have to debug to find what the message is, but I know for fact that it came from address "PDC = 0x60, and that message received can be used to trigger the front camera..... I guess......


Is just an idea, because like you've told upper on this thread we can automatically start front camera using the speed signal but will work very much in city driving, and this way it only will show the front image when the front PDC chimes, and that's the time that image is really needed.
If I can help with some Ibus message debugging count on me for that. Mather of fact will start to test that concept by putting something on the front of the car and read what messages are being sent by 0x60, and if I find a message that only occurs when the front is triggered I think we have our problem SOLVED....

Keep up the good work.

[Andre]

Well, as I remember the problem is, that PDC is not on, until it will be startet (manually or by reverse gear). When it's on, the app will switch to PDC screen or show the popup (if there is anything to show). But in "off" status the PDC do not work, meassure distances etc. There is no "standby" or something.

And if I think of generally activating the PDC at speed lower e.g. 5km/h .. it will be on at each crossing. I do not know if this was nice? 

[freddykat]

Well, as I remember the problem is, that PDC is not on, until it will be startet (manually or by reverse gear). When it's on, the app will switch to PDC screen or show the popup (if there is anything to show). But in "off" status the PDC do not work, meassure distances etc. There is no "standby" or something.

And if I think of generally activating the PDC at speed lower e.g. 5km/h .. it will be on at each crossing. I do not know if this was nice? 

Yes, its an "intermediate" solution. Almost perfect I must say.


I think we should approach this problem dividing into 2 separate issues:

1 - Activation of PDC module: (if module don't make it by itself)
     Manual cars: Between 1km/h (as soon as it detects forward motion) ~ 15 km/h 
     Automatic: If speed is bellow 15km/h when in D or fall bellow 15km/h

-> The thing is that I can't confirm today if just by rolling at slow speed the front ones become enable or do we need to make a Reverse engaged first to have that 30 seconds activation on the front...... waiting for the module to arrive..... to have some results.....
If it activates itself bellow 30kmh (no reverse) we have the turning PDC on/off sorted out.......  
If not we need to simulate via IBUS the press of PDC activation button..... thus making the car thinking that we have turned them On manually as per the BMW manual. (see bellow BMW E39/E60 Car User manual, PDC operation segment ) 

Conditions for switching on and off PDC is switched on under the following conditions: 
- PDC button pressed (PDC switched on manually) 
- Reverse gear engaged (PDC switched on automatically) 
PDC is switched off under the following conditions: 
- PDC button pressed (PDC switched off manually) 
- Ignition switched off (PDC switched off automatically 
- After driving approx. 50 meters 
- After exceeding a speed of 30 km/h

This part im abording only the pure PDC part, the camera issue is aborded bellow:

2- Activation of the front camera:
    
If the PDC module activation by speed is possible then we should be able to use the sensor measured values to trigger/or not the front camera.

I think the lower threshold of 1kmh is good for the owners of manual trans cars because they don't have the D(or any forward switch to indicate forward motion) and 15kmh seems a bit high to park but is just an idea.
Another OEM function is that even in D and slower speeds then 30Km/h if we move more than 50 meters it will automatically disengage, so we need to take account for the speed and the distance we move...

Let us image some traffic situation or better heavy traffic, we bellow the upper 30km/h threshold but it is not difficult to drive 3-4 km in 10km/h situations...
So the first 50mts we have PDC but after we have to engage it again.....

If: Speed < 30km/h & distance is almost 50.1 mt then "emulate" PDC button press to enable further 50mt......

I know it seems odd..... and was just an idea......

Hope it gives you some inspiration to solve this



PDC manual

[freddykat]

Well, as I remember the problem is, that PDC is not on, until it will be startet (manually or by reverse gear). When it's on, the app will switch to PDC screen or show the popup (if there is anything to show). But in "off" status the PDC do not work, meassure distances etc. There is no "standby" or something.

And if I think of generally activating the PDC at speed lower e.g. 5km/h .. it will be on at each crossing. I do not know if this was nice? 

Yes, its an "intermediate" solution. Almost perfect I must say.


I think we should approach this problem dividing into 2 separate issues:

1 - Activation of PDC module: (if module don't make it by itself)
     Manual cars: Between 1km/h (as soon as it detects forward motion) ~ 15 km/h 
     Automatic: If speed is bellow 15km/h when in D or fall bellow 15km/h

-> The thing is that I can't confirm today if just by rolling at slow speed the front ones become enable or do we need to make a Reverse engaged first to have that 30 seconds activation on the front...... waiting for the module to arrive..... to have some results.....
If it activates itself bellow 30kmh (no reverse) we have the turning PDC on/off sorted out.......  
If not we need to simulate via IBUS the press of PDC activation button..... thus making the car thinking that we have turned them On manually as per the BMW manual. (see bellow BMW E39/E60 Car User manual, PDC operation segment ) 

Conditions for switching on and off PDC is switched on under the following conditions: 
- PDC button pressed (PDC switched on manually) 
- Reverse gear engaged (PDC switched on automatically) 
PDC is switched off under the following conditions: 
- PDC button pressed (PDC switched off manually) 
- Ignition switched off (PDC switched off automatically 
- After driving approx. 50 meters 
- After exceeding a speed of 30 km/h

This part im abording only the pure PDC part, the camera issue is aborded bellow:

2- Activation of the front camera:
    
If the PDC module activation by speed is possible then we should be able to use the sensor measured values to trigger/or not the front camera.

I think the lower threshold of 1kmh is good for the owners of manual trans cars because they don't have the D(or any forward switch to indicate forward motion) and 15kmh seems a bit high to park but is just an idea.
Another OEM function is that even in D and slower speeds then 30Km/h if we move more than 50 meters it will automatically disengage, so we need to take account for the speed and the distance we move...

Let us image some traffic situation or better heavy traffic, we bellow the upper 30km/h threshold but it is not difficult to drive 3-4 km in 10km/h situations...
So the first 50mts we have PDC but after we have to engage it again.....

If: Speed < 30km/h & distance is almost 50.1 mt then "emulate" PDC button press to enable further 50mt......

I know it seems odd..... and was just an idea......

Hope it gives you some inspiration to solve this



PDC manual

Well, this was a very productive night of research.
I've been updating my NcsExpert and NcsDummy and found some "new" translation that can be useful for our goal.
The last translation doesn't have those fields identified and that's why only now I've realized some "extra" functions.
I've put some NcsDummy photos to make my point.

On this pic, we see an option if we like to turn on the PDC via reverse engaged or via speed signal



This 2 variables about the speed I haven't confirm if the first table is the switch on speed like 1/2kmh



On the other hand, this value is almost certain defined from the factory for the 30km/h that we've seen on the car user manual.



This parameter seems to me that is related to the distance that even we do not cross the PDC speed upper threshold is from the factory the 50 Mt's



Of course on the tables above, we only see values by model, ex. e36/e39/e46/etc, but using the NcsDummy guide provided bellow we can use some "custom values".
Let us think like this if we decompose the table into binary or numeral and found the "50" value we know that that specific value is basically meters.
So if we want some more distance until PDC auto disengage bellow 30km and 3km on heavy traffic seems reasonable, the adequate value should be 3000, representing 3000mts until auto disengage.

---

Also, I found by this new version of NcsDummy that we can have "custom values" to those fields that came only with "wert_01" etc...
A picture is more powerful than 100 words.... hehe







I hope this is handy to you, and if more debug and test are needed please count on me.

[freddykat]

Some people may find me too much responsive to posts but.....
Upon some digging on the NcsDummy, I found some of the things that have to be changed (from OEM codding) with codding software to fit our needs.

On this PDC part, we will see that the value of ABSCHALT_GESCHWINDIGKEIT is for every module is Data: 30
So based on the user manual referred above the 30 value on that field fits perfectly for the max operating speed of 30 km/h that is defined from the factory, so we know that WE CAN change this value to our desire. (see conditions for on/off PDC)


On PDC, we will see that the value of ABSCHALTWEG - SWITCH-OFF DISTANCE is for every module is Data: 50
So based on the user manual referred above the 50 value on that field fits perfectly for the 50 meters until switch-off that is defined from the factory, however from our first post we have seen trouble how to bypass the 50 meters off condition of the PDC module, but I found out to be only a codding issue.
It seems reasonable to define it to 3000.  
The 3000 value is correspondent to 3000 meters = 3.0 km  I this is sufficient for heavy traffic and should be used to give new instructions for the switch off distance.

 

On PDC, we will see that the value of EINSCHALT_GESCHWINDIGKEIT - SWITCH-ON SPEED is for every module is Data: 0



And well this is when the conflicting parts come across....... Maybe we can set it to 1kmh.... will try and give results on this, however, there's another option that may need codding before the "SWITCH-ON SPEED" one first..... there is PDC_AKTIV/DEAKTIV..... that needs some coding.....

PDC_AKTIV/DEAKTIV gives the 2 following lines from the factory:
weg_geschw - speed activation (the new line that SHOULD BE SELECTED to have PDC not triggered by Reverse but only speed dependant!
rueckwaertsgang - reverse gear activation (the option is set on the factory, will change it!)









And this here the fun part is coming, for what im expecting the module won't need to be set to reverse to have those few seconds on Front_PDC but constantly if within the speed range that has been set (0-30km/h during 3000meters).
If the PDC button is present, well you can disengage and engage the PDC if you are stopped or bellow 30kmh.....


I hope it helps @Andre to develop the idea further.